EP 2180 Chris Bishop started professional life as a touring rock and roll bass player with a band that was the underbill for The Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, ZZ Top, Linda Ronstadt, Uriah Heap, Billy Preston, Weather Report, Return to Forever, Blue Oyster Cult and Frank Zappa. After the band broke up, he was a freelance bass player for many other famous acts before beginning a journey through 7 more careers. In this interview, we speak about succeeding at careers that don’t exist yet.
Finding Careers That Don’t Exist Yet? Huh? | No BS Job Search Advice Radio
Jeff Altman 00:01
So, my guest today is Christopher Bishop, you can call him Chris, who's a workplace futurist, who's had eight careers so far, including touring rock musician, jingle producer, website project manager, among others. He spent 15 years in corporate in IBM in a variety of roles, including business strategy, consultant, communications, executive, and thriving social media adoption much better, and the use of virtual worlds for training events. He's also got a program that we'll talk about later on, that will help you experience shall we say, succeed at jobs that don't exist yet. Christopher or Chris, welcome! I appreciate having you on today.
Christopher Bishop 00:53
Well, thank you, Jeff. I'm delighted to be here, man. Looking forward to our conversation! Thanks for inviting me.
Jeff Altman 00:57
It is my pleasure. With that, let me just start by saying eight careers. Is there a common theme that runs through some of these careers or through all of them?
Christopher Bishop 01:15
So, I'm a curious guy, I'm always interested in kind of new stuff, slightly new tech, but looking to do things that I get bored easily, maybe I'm looking to do things that are interesting to keep me engaged. The other thing I would say is, themes that have run through these eight careers are could be summarized sort of in three data points or four, if you will. Chase the Maelstrom. Find the chaos, go for the mayhem. So, by that, I mean, I'm seeing a theme there. So, my advice is, go where they don't know what it is yet. The Royal they, existing business models or organizations, and that approach has served me well in 45 years since I graduated from college with a degree in German lit of all things.
Jeff Altman 02:10
German lit majors.
Christopher Bishop 02:12
Oh, yeah, ways to translate the menus for the band when you're on the road. That's the real world application for the head skill. But it's like fine, where they don't know what it is and then you can contribute. You can help create whatever the new thing is and with any luck being remunerated, make a living, get paid to do it.
Jeff Altman 02:33
So, in navigating from being a touring rock musician, by the way, there's no such thing as rock and roll anymore. So, how do you actually manage this?
Christopher Bishop 02:45
Yeah, well, so, I turned to this band right after college, and did three albums with them and open for bands like the eagles and ZZ Top and Fleetwood Mac. Then the band woke up typical standard deviation curve, which is this band? Where's this band? When we broke up, I moved to New York, and became a studio musician played with people like Robert Palmer and Chuck Berry and Bo Diddley, and Ronnie Spector and then I came over tour one time and said, how I sleep in my own bed at night, as all my musician friends. They said, jingles man, you got to break into the session scene. I was like, okay, well, let me figure that out. So, I tracked down anyone and everyone I knew in that business, and to call them this is way before LinkedIn or email, obviously, this is like the early 80s. I introduced myself and said, can you give me three names that I can call and basically built my network and eventually broke into the session seen as a person, as a bass player, and then as an arranger, and then as a composer, and finally as a producer. So, in about 1985, music became data.
So, by that I mean, the technology had emerged, it allowed you to sample and sequence meaning capture instrument tambours, digitally and store them on a in this case, a Winchester hard drive, which was a big box like the size of a toaster oven, stored 512 K and had to slide it into this big rack. But I became intrigued with tech and computers, I bought a Mac plus and learned how to program it, and how to sequence I then made a musical instrument digital interface. How to stripe a track simply so I could chase the pictures lay in the sound effects exactly the right moment they would speak when the film went by. So, that was my introduction to technology and the Segway. I became intrigued with this wacky technology called the worldwide web in the early 90s when I was working to shingle house and taught myself to be a web producer, hung out a shingle, worked about a couple of seminal interactive agencies in New York.
Much to my surprise, I got an opportunity to interview at IBM, because they were building out their corporate intranet programs at the time in 1998. They hired me on the spot to join this big corporation, like, what would I do at IBM. But the key is it has a message for your listeners. I didn't get hired IBM, because I was cute or had a hip shirt or a stylish hairdo or whatever. I got hired because I had a skill that they needed at that point in time. To be honest, there weren't a lot of people who knew how to produce websites in the late 90s. So, they put together this team and we were sent out to the business to help drive standards, both from a design and technology perspective.
Jeff Altman 05:46
I want to interpret some things that you said for the audience because you gave not just one lesson, but a lot of them along the way in describing it. So, let's see what I heard. Okay, so, you had an itch, you want to get off the rope and instead of trying to figure it out yourself, you asked some people what they thought you might be able to do. They gave you an idea of something that was proximate to what you were already doing. Because that is he was still music. But it wasn't touring music. It was the idea of getting into jingles. But there were going to be steps for getting into jingles. So, you started talking to people, and eventually got your first entree into local music. Obviously, not everyone returned your call.
Much of the same way folks, not everyone is going to respond to your message on LinkedIn, or respond to the email or text that you send them. But you were determined, and you persevered, despite frustration, until eventually you broke into something, maybe not where you ultimately wanted to get to. But it was steps along the way that moved you in that direction until eventually; I heard the magic words, jingle house. There were a couple of steps before jingle house that you did that kept getting you closer. So, folks recognize you may not be able to do a direct leap from where you are now to where you want to get to. You may need to take steps to move you in that direction where you're still touring at all. During that time, I was still doing some gigs.
Christopher Bishop 07:35
I actually had a residency in New York. I was playing four nights a week at an Irish bar on East 86th Street. We used to play down the east coast in DC and Philly. Sometimes I would get a call for a jingle date the next morning. I'd literally sleep two hours and get on the train and go back to New York and do the date at eight or nine in the morning. Go to my loft and lower Manhattan, take a nap get back on the train, go back to Philly or DC. So, it's a real mixed bag because I knew if I didn't take the jingle date, they go down the list and go to the next guy. Needless to say, there are a lot of guys lined up ready to play on those dates.
Jeff Altman 08:15
Folks, notice, there's a hustle component to all of this, you're going to have to hustle and do things that are going to make you uncomfortable.
Christopher Bishop 08:25
Yeah. So, Jeff, I just want to extrapolate on what you said, which I think was very insightful. The idea is, for me anyway, I had a set of transferable skills. There was a delta; there was a gap, a set of skills that I needed to acquire. To your listeners or viewers, that's always going to be the case. You're going to know how to do something, and you're going to need to know how to do something else. So, see if I can share this quickly. But a terrific example I think of this for me in my life was that I went from being a jingle producer to being a web producer. The way that worked for me was in the jingle bass. There are a set of actors. There's a singer and a guitar player and a copyist and a recording engineer, and a client and a budget and a deliverable, 32nd spot for TV. In the web business, there are different set of actors or players, but the end result is the same. So, in the web, there's like a copywriter and a scripter and a coder and a graphic designer.
But there's a client and a budget and deliverable. So, I took my jungle producing skills at a Meta level and transfer them but that meant I had to learn about HTML. I read a lot of books. I went to New York Mac user groups meetings and in the city met people went to some classes actually took some graphic design classes have stayed up late surfing the web, looking at the source code to figure out how they put this stuff together. How did they make these website things? I got to a point where I felt comfortable enough that I could oversee a team that I hung out a shingle and got some gigs as a web producer. So, I encourage you, again, listeners and viewers to keep that in mind what do you know how to do? What do you want to do? What are the skills, you're going to need to have to do what you want to do? Where can you get them, go get them, and then move on and do it again, and again.
Jeff Altman 10:21
That leads to a question about how people can gain knowledge. So, early in the 21st century, any of you are going to make it past the middle of this century. We're for now and I have to say for now, because the learning has changed a lot and is going to continue to change. As of now, where do you see people can start acquiring knowledge and skills that are going to profit them for years to come?
Christopher Bishop 11:01
Well, so, let me just lead by giving you a quote from David Blake, who's the former CEO of a company called degreed. They have a cloud based tool that connects corporate learning management systems, with what he calls publicly available learning assets. They could be blogs or books, or newspapers or TED talks or videos or Wikipedia entries or whatever. But his mantra, his manifesto is, the future doesn't care how you became an expert. The follow on to that is, the good news is lots of ways to acquire information today. The bad news is there are lots of ways to acquire information today. So, you can get data from taking courses, certainly going to college and not dissuading you unless you want to get a teal fellowship and start your own company.
But there are also many adjacent ancillary channels. I think of things like MOOCs, massively open online courses. Companies like Coursera, EdX, Khan Academy, and LinkedIn learning where I have a course actually a little plug. There's lots of ways you can get information, Wikipedia, TED talks are a terrific source of information. So, the challenge is rationalizing and doing triage on the sources. So, figuring out where the conversations are going on that align with your interests, and ultimately what your career objectives might be. So, the learner is in control. That's the cool news.
Jeff Altman 12:34
Yeah, it's a big shift. For the longest time, it was the big bureaucratic University. They had decided what was important and you are the consumer folks.
Christopher Bishop 12:51
I think historically, education has been thought of as an event that happened in the past. It's like that is no longer is viable. You're going to be learning your whole life. It's a lifelong adventure. It's a never ending, nonstop journey. So, embrace it, enjoy it. It's cool.
Jeff Altman 13:11
There are lots of places to learn. You've mentioned a couple. I'll use an example from yesterday with me. I was on the app clubhouse. I stumbled into a conversation that was going on, where the head of I want to say Logitech was on. He was talking about entering a creative economy. It caught my attention without going into the details of his origami or his contention. It hit with me. I've been exploring that sense. I see places where it's clearly applicable to what I do, like the podcast, the YouTube show, all the other things I do that basically allow people to get to know like, trust and respect me for my abilities. Folks, you could be doing the same thing. In this case, it was clubhouse that gave me an idea about how to communicate with people. I'll also say those on clubhouse. I mentioned this earlier. My wife has been with her sister now for six months for use of waffle COVID person. I was in a club on clubhouse and listened to a number of doctors who run COVID treatment facilities around the world with some of how they approach treatment. For that, I was able to go explore and find comparable facilities near my sister in law. Again, you learn things and get yourself out and about.
Christopher Bishop 15:05
Yeah, lots of different opportunities. I also encourage people, especially students to explore areas out of your comfort zone. I know that's a clich�, for sure. But when I talk to students that say science oriented, I say, well, why don't you take a course on medieval Irish literature as well, while you're at it? Or people who are studying economics, it's like, well, why don't you take a course in ancient Greek philosophy to because, again, the rate and pace at which products and services are evolving, and innovative companies require a different mindset, they don't require an unique skill, necessarily, they require the ability to be a creative problem solver, to be resourceful and resilient, to be comfortable with ambiguity, to be aware of your role as a global citizen. We're all kind of in this together at this point to 21st century global borderless workplace, to be able to work across disciplines. So, again, I encourage listeners to expand their horizons, its studies of the humanities that represent opportunities on the kind of thinking that's going to make you successful through the rest of this century.
Jeff Altman 16:09
Unless it brings the question to my mind about eventually we have to get to this idea that there could be jobs that are going to exist that don't exist right now. So, what are the ways that people can find these new jobs if they emerge? What's going to allow them to spot them early? Because that was a big part of your journeys and spotting trends early and getting on board early?
Christopher Bishop 16:41
So, I would say a key aspect of job didn't exist yet, is it they're going to be the nebula. They're going to be created at what I describe as the intersection of traditionally or historically unconnected disciplines. So, think about that for a second. The example I site is Nano-pharmacy. So, the three chemists won the Nobel Prize a few years ago for developing Nano-machines. So, these are machines that operate 10 to the minus nine. So, just to give you a sense of perspective, whether that's a real thing or not, MIT opened a building, a nine story $400 million facility on the MIT campus focused on nanotechnology exclusively. Now, the adjacent discipline around pharmacy is that you're now able to build Nano-bots that deliver pharmacology to tumors or wounds are whatever at the atomic or molecular level, very specific. So, the days of radiation and chemo are hopefully going away sooner than later.
There's a cool thing called neural dust that these two doctors at UC Berkeley put together. It's an implantable device, the size of a grain of rice, and it generates ultrasonic sounds to stimulate tumors, it also collects information about pharmacology and physiology. So, although saying, keep your eyes and ears open for disciplines that are connecting, that haven't connected before, and that's where the new jobs are going to be. There are ways to find these signals, with all lack of modesty, it's not brain surgery. It's not rocket science. It's like, if you pay attention, and look for the right sources, you can see where things are merging and morphing and connecting, autonomous vehicles. Another example, at some point, we probably in the right settings won't be driving cars anymore; we'll be doing something else in those vehicles. The idea of like 5000 pounds of steel and glass moving 150 pound carbon based life form around is really inefficient. So, people are looking for ways to find a better solution to that problem.
Jeff Altman 19:01
Absolutely true! I think in terms of another example, in our times, did anyone hear the term messenger RNA until last year?
Christopher Bishop 19:12
Yeah, totally! It's technology that connects. It's all certainly driven by technology and new careers are going to be certainly by tech, they're going to require old and new skills. They're going to exist again. They're going to exist at the intersection of disciplines that maybe haven't connected in the past and it's exciting. I think it's interesting. Again, I encourage listeners or watchers to look for where those intersections are taking place.
Jeff Altman 19:47
Curious, what was even featuring is things that involve tech. Is that really where you're seeing the future is just intersections where tech and a field are starting to rub up against one another.
Christopher Bishop 20:02
Yeah, a tech writ large! So, a couple of things! Every company today is a technology company, whether they like it or not. If they're not, that's going out of business strategy. You've got to embrace the leading edge technology or your competitors, your competitors are going to be doing it. So, you have to find ways, and maybe not all of it is appropriate or can be deployed in a beneficial manner. But you being C suites, running companies, you need to be aware that technology is what drives innovation, and ultimately, profitability. I think there's this great book called technological revolutions and financial capital, by Carlota Perez, she's a Venezuelan economist, teaches at Cambridge. But she talks about five cycles of technological innovation, starting with like automated knitting machines. In the early 18th century, people trying to figure out what to do with them, people felt like it was putting people out of work similar to the reactions to AI and robotics in 2021. Eventually, thank goodness, Queen Elizabeth allowed adoption of this automated knitting machine functionality and the rest is history. So, these are cycles that have been going on literally for hundreds of years. So, take as a student or a learner or early career person, take a deep breath and realize that this is a pattern we've seen, and many times, and it works out well, it has historically.
Jeff Altman 21:39
As long as you don't panic! I'll use an example. From end of last century, there were people who used to be called typists. They would sit at a typewriter all day, a remarkably inefficient medium, because you had these ribbons, and it made mistakes when you typed. There was a product that you used to correct the mistakes laid out which was called White out which was horrible. Then they eventually came up with a paper version that you'd insert into type and it was awful. Then the first sign of automation showed up in these very limited capabilities, word processing devices that cause the generation of typists to freak out and the ones that are adapted to the new device, left the other ones behind, earned more money and allowed themselves to realize I can adapt to change so that the first PC showed up. They really once were doing word processing.
Christopher Bishop 22:57
Yeah, great examples, like Hidden Figures. Those women knew how to put together ballistic trajectories, by hand using algebra or whatever trigonometry, they were ready to understand how IBM computers, how the system 360, whatever work and they again, transferable skills, they had to learn how to program using Hollerith cards or whatever, but they had skills and they knew what the net result was supposed to be at a meta level, like trajectories for ballistics, that's what we're looking to do here. So, this is a new tool to do it.
Jeff Altman 23:39
Folks, again, the idea of adapting once you spot something; you're probably not the only one who's seeing it. But you can be the one who acts on it because that's one of the things that people don't do is act on these things and they let others do it. I'll use an example for myself and this is a non tech example. In the 1970s, a business partner and I had an idea for it all into a coffee mug there because we were not happy with what was the existing plastic cup at that time. Frankly, you had a lift off the top to be able to drink the coffee. We couldn't come up with someone who could design the hole. We couldn't find someone who could do that for us and thus we let it drop. Every coffee cup has that hole, the sliding hole. There was first the tear back whole right there and it's the idea of acting that becomes so important. It doesn't mean you have to quit your job tomorrow. It's about going out and exploring ideas and not be not being sedentary.
Christopher Bishop 25:13
Another point I want to make about sort of new businesses and new careers is that I described not everyone is a rock star. But in order for Beyonc� or sting to go on stages is a whole coterie of people that need to help make that happen. The same model or metaphor is true of technology. So, for example, I'm very involved in quantum technologies days. So, I'm the master of ceremonies at a virtual event called insight quantum technology. But the idea is, certainly the particle physicist and the electrical engineers get a lot of the press. But people with adjacent skills in other disciplines are going to be needed to drive understanding and ultimately adoption of this new technology. It's been ever thought so, while the technology is at the core, cubits if you will, but someone's got to be in a marketing and role to write about it and promote it, someone's got to be in a journalism role.
Someone's got to be an educator; they got to be teaching about quantum, the profession that enables all their professions, someone's got to come up with investment strategies behind quantum, someone's got to sell the stuff at the end of the day. Biz Dev, who's going to go out and make a case to clients and get them to open their checkbook, and based on an assessment of what the business value of this new technology is going to be. So, again, I would encourage listeners, maybe you're not a particle physicist, but you want to be involved in quantum, there's lots of ways to get involved. That's true with any technology that's going on today. So, keep that in mind. I think it's an important point that doesn't get a lot of play when conversations about technology come up.
Jeff Altman 26:59
Think of a cycle angel.co is being a website, where there are startups doing interesting work, some pretty boring work as well. Where you can go exploring MCs me see what their current status even get involved with the startup even if you're not a technical person, there are a lot of jobs that these firms are hiring for or they're looking for advisors for them, you can make a contribution to them, and ride with them.
Christopher Bishop 27:32
You can even come in, say, as an operations person, as you learn how the business runs, and what the challenges are, you might find yourself with opportunities to move up the value chain or the management chain. So, let's get Bob in here, because he did a great job running the backend system. He might have some ideas about what the next strategy should be for how we create our product or service or whatever. So, I encourage people to explore,
Jeff Altman 28:00
We're at an interesting time in the world. For a long time we've been looking at, basically a global and borderless workplace and borders makes start to get reinforced again, as the US becomes more concerned about China and other nations, and their capacity to affect the US economy. But overall, we're living at a time where information is free. The ability to manage information or to use that information in creative ways is important if you're talking to young learners, trying to prepare themselves for this kind of environment. This is going to be true for the old guys, too.
Christopher Bishop 28:59
Yeah, for sure! So, I have something that I call my future career toolkit. It's three steps, and is based on me reflecting on and attempting to codify processes that I've used over the course of these eight careers. So, I don't want to go into too much detail. But the idea is that the tools are voice antenna and mesh. The Voice tool is based on ideation exercise that a dear friend of mine, Brian Mattawa, has a brilliant ideation guru and does this for big companies and has for 30 years. We put together triggers, think of your favorite movie, TV show, book or game and what about it resonates with you and use that as a way to focus on what your core interests or passions might be. So, for me, for example, my favorite movie recently was Blade Runner 2049. I love that movie. So, about three times I saw it in IMAX. I saw it in 3D. I started in a regular theater. But my interest is in future culture and technology, how they're going to intersect.
So, that's what teases out of that reflection right on that movie. So, to continue that toolkit process, the next tool is antenna and what that involves is looking for where conversations are going on around the topics to tease out of the voice exercise. So, for me, on future career and culture, there's a website called futurism that I follow, they publish newsletters. The MIT tech review publishes very specific newsletters around sort of AI and space and crypto and block chain. There's a TV show called BBC click, it's on every week. They do really interesting stories about technology and business sort of bleeding edge technologies and how they're being adopted and how they might be adopted. Another great show is Bloomberg technology, which is a daily show, 5pm every day, Emily Chang fantastic moderator. I described it as a little bit like Entertainment Tonight for Silicon Valley. Are they going to Tim Costello's leaving twitter, oh, my goodness, what are we going to do? How's he going to manage it? But the conversations are really interesting, around leading edge technology and investment, certainly where's the money going? Who thinks there's a pony in there?
So, those are some of the sources and then the third tool is mesh, which is a 3d data visualization exercise, how to build your mega network and it's tracking down and I encourage people to use LinkedIn, although there are other ways to do it. Certainly, many academics, for example, don't have LinkedIn profiles, but you can find them on their university websites, but go on LinkedIn, put in Boolean parameters based on the voice findings, and track down people who are leading conversations, future oriented, innovative, thought leaders, who are talking about whatever the topic is that you're interested in. So, I've tracked people like Tom Malone who is a professor at MIT Sloan, he wrote a great book called the future of work many years ago. Gary Linhart is a futurist lives in Zurich runs webinars periodically, Krysta is the GM of quantum at Microsoft. So, I connected with her and follow her. So, those are the three tools. That's the processes and I run these workshops at universities, called how to succeed at jobs that don't exist yet. I put some preamble about social historical perspective, the concepts around intersecting disciplines, and then I end with taking the students through the future career toolkit.
Christopher Bishop 30:07
Thus, that brings me to the question of how can people find out more about you and the work that you do everything?
Christopher Bishop 32:56
Well, the first thing I would say is, please connect with me on LinkedIn. I'm always open to LinkedIn requests, and I'm happy to have a conversation either using the messaging tool or send me an email or I give you my instance and you can schedule some time with me. I'm always happy to talk about these topics, it's my passion.
Jeff Altman 33:14
Do you know the URL for your LinkedIn profile?
Christopher Bishop 33:17
I think it's LinkedIn/ChristopherBishop123.
Jeff Altman 33:24
So, folks that'd be @linkedin.com/In/ChristopherBishop123. I'll check before it goes into the show notes.
Christopher Bishop 33:32
I think that's right, that's me. So do that. And then I have a website called improvising careers.com and lay out more detail around the toolkit. I kept a travel log back when I used to do a lot of traveling and speaking in person, not so much anymore. It's all virtual but so information about my multiple careers as well as some fun pictures on the website of me at age 22 and addressing would like hair down to here, tuning up my Fender Bass getting ready to go on stage was hoping for somebody doing a gig somewhere.
Jeff Altman 34:08
So, I saw a picture of a friend of mine took of Les Paul, some years ago, in his home with all the guitars strewn around that Gibson had sent to him. My friend asked him where you sleep since his bedroom was overrun with guitars. He said, I got a couch over there!
Christopher Bishop 34:29
Yeah, sleeping is but not a priority at that point in his life. So, yeah, please connect with me. I tweet as well; Chris Bishop is my Twitter handle. I tweet about this these topics and other topics. I'm interested in the quantum space leading edge technology future of work.
Jeff Altman 34:50
Excellent! If you'll notice one thing folks, Chris has spoken a lot about things that are going to require you to hustle. It's not going to land in your lap while you're sitting around watching Netflix. You're going to have to think and notice and act on the things that you notice to go explore and use your native curiosity that Netflix and the others do an excellent job of dollar now.
Christopher Bishop 35:23
The other thing I'd say is, I liken it to direct mail. So, I say, again, to young learners, or even early career millennial or whatever, it's a numbers game at the end of the day. You got to jiggle doorknobs. Direct mail model is if you send 100 postcards, if one person responds, you're doing pretty well. It's like three people respond, you're getting a fantastic result. So, don't be discouraged. Don't be dissuaded, the right match will appear. You'll find the right setting the right hiring manager, whoever thinks your skills map to their objectives. Again, it's a quid pro quo. So, they're not hiring you because they think you're cute, or you're going to entertain at the Christmas party. Similar to my IBM story, they hired me into IBM, because I had a skill they needed, there was going to help make them successful. It was going to help some big P&L, make his bogey, and get his number.
Jeff Altman 36:22
So, profit and loss statement requirement, just making sure that the audience gets
Christopher Bishop 36:27
Yes, for sure. I don't mean to be glib with the acronyms, apologies. But the idea is, keep chasing it and the right setting will appear. It's what I did to break into the jingle bells, too. I reached for literally, dozens, if not hundreds of producers, musicians, singers, arrangers, copyist recording engineers, creative directors, and eventually one producer at an agency Backers Bill Vogel thought I was capable of doing what he needed. He hired me to play bass on a Miller genuine draft beer commercial and then I was in. I had credibility. I can tell people yeah, I played on a Miller commercial last week.
Jeff Altman 37:15
This is fabulous. Chris. Thank you. Folks, we'll be back soon with more. This is Jeff Altman, The Big Game Hunter. Hope you enjoyed today's interview. If you didn't, you're watching on YouTube, click the like button, share it do something that lets people know it was worthwhile. I also want to suggest you connect with me on LinkedIn @linkedIn.com/In/thebiggamehunter. Mention that you saw the interview. I like knowing I'm helping some folks. I'll also say I've got a lot of great information on my website, thebiggamehunter.us. While you're there, go to the blog, go exploring. You can also schedule time for a free discovery call scheduled time for coaching. Look at my courses, the books I have out. There's a lot there. Lastly, hope you have a terrific day and most importantly, be great. Take care.
Christopher Bishop 38:10
ABOUT JEFF ALTMAN, THE BIG GAME HUNTER
Jeff Altman, The Big Game Hunter is a coach who worked as a recruiter for what seems like one hundred years. His work involves career coaching, as well as executive job search coaching, job coaching, and interview coaching. He is the host of “No BS Job Search Advice Radio,” the #1 podcast in iTunes for job search with more than 2100 episodes.
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