Shifting Your Mindset During Your Job Search Part 1| No BS Job Search Advice Radio

EP  2126 So often, people develop a mindset that can only be described as “stinkin’ thinkin'” or “doom and gloom.” It doesn’t serve you. On today’s interview with Lisa Rangel, we discussed how to shift that mindset and recalibrate. This is Part 1. Part 2 will be released tomorrow.

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Mindset shift


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Jeff Altman 00:10
Feel free if you want to drink something during this, we are going to do a lot of talking because that's the way I try and structure it.

Lisa Rangel 00:18
Okay, no worries.

Jeff Altman 00:19
Yes, I do speak in but with that, so my guest today is the one, the only Lisa Rangel. She's the president and CEO of Chameleon Resumes. Chameleon is the only executive resume writing, LinkedIn profile development and job search consultancy hired by LinkedIn for a years to help premium members win interviews faster and negotiate the maximum compensation. Lisa, welcome.

Lisa Rangel 01:06
I'm so happy to be here Jeff, thank you so much for asking me.

Jeff Altman 01:10
You're very welcome, love to see a smile on your face.

Lisa Rangel 01:17

Jeff Altman 01:17
Good. Essentially, we're going to be talking about shifting your mindset because most of you have a case of, what Zig Ziglar used to call stinking, thinking and he made rules that still serve you, so it creates the question to start off, why do people struggle so much with this kind of stuff?

Lisa Rangel 01:36
You know, it's obviously been a rough year and people struggling the reasons could be numerous, many valid and even if it's not a big reason in some people's minds, it's still valid in their minds, right, so it's been a rough year but I find that a common theme for those who've been successful in landing jobs during this tumultuous period is that, not that they have nothing negative going on in their lives but they tend to really zero in, on the moment that they're sitting at their computer or they're on a phone call or on a zoom call and they just tried to make the best of the moment that they're in, so they'll send the most positive pointed email that they can or they'll send a positive vibe on a zoom call like, they'll just not necessarily think about everything else going on in their life or the world but they will zero in and try to be mindful of the moment they're in and make the best of it and I find that's a common theme in the clients that we're working with that have success is that they're just focused on, what's working and what's in front of them.

Jeff Altman 02:54
It's funny we must be from social work school which I have an MSW, they used to call that partial sing, you zero in on the one thing that's right in front of you and push the other things aside for a period of time, so that you provide best performance right then and there. Because....

Lisa Rangel 03:14
It's funny you bring that reference to social work because I come from a sales background, you know recruiting and sales background and I called it, what's closest to the money, focus on what's closest to the money, you don't get wrapped up in all the things you can do that sidetrack you and get you off your game and it was like, what's the one activity that's the closest to the money and in job searching, it's what's the activity that's going to get you closer to landing the job. Some days that's starting over and reaching out to somebody that you haven't talked to in a while sometimes that's preparing for the interview that you have right in front of you, I think, if the concept is similar that you're mentioning, it's just interesting to hear that from the Social Work standpoint, I hadn't heard that before that's not my background but I think we're all basically peddling the same stuff, it's really just staying focused on, what you can do and doing your best to compartmentalize, what you can't help in the moment, just so you can move forward to, what you can do.

Jeff Altman 04:15
And this obviously existed pre COVID and folks we're recording this in March 2021, so now when Lisa is referencing, no tough year, it's the Covid year obviously but she and I both have been around the block a couple of times in recruiting and as a result we both know that this existed way before that.

Lisa Rangel 04:36
Absolutely. Yeah, it just became compounded in the Covid, it's something that we needed to do, to try to still move forward even if it's slowly, even if it's three steps forward and two and a half back, it still directly move forward and it still the best you can to move forward and I find that a lot were of you meditating officially or just taking moment to breath or not packing your day with fifty things to do when you have control over that, just anything you can do to just take a moment to appreciate the moment that you have a roof over your head, you have your health hopefully that day and then just doing the activity that is in front of you and leaving the result up to the universe to bring to you, what it supposed to bring to you. I think it sounds a little woo and I am not necessarily a religious person but I find that just, what you do it's just some kind of the best you can, the universe will provide and that drop you.

Jeff Altman 05:40
That's was such a tough one for people to hear because especially in US culture, of course, we're action oriented, we want to take control, we got to do stuff because otherwise we look lazy or what your partner will say, "Okay, what are you doing today? Rejuvenate the house as fast as possible". Oh....

Lisa Rangel 06:03
I'm not recovering, busy a holic by far and I say recovering because I fall into it now and again, I'd have to get myself out of it but I think, compounded with that is the expectation. Managing expectations, I think is another huge one and you know, I had a conversation, it just reminds me of a conversation I had with someone recently who was really struggling because she felt the interviews weren't going well, so she felt downtrodden to go reach out and get more, right because if it's not going well, you don't want to do more of it especially during a time we already not feeling so good to begin with, we had to reframe, what her expectations of the interviewer, okay, have some compassion for the person on the other side of the zoom screen. Maybe that recruiter or that hiring manager is also having a bad day and yes they have a job and you don't but that doesn't mean they are having a bad day either. So maybe your expectation for the interview is to really just make a human connection versus land a job which I know sounds really strange when you're a job seeker but if you're constantly being let down by an interview, not going as perfectly as it should or that the person on the other side of the screen not being as prepared as they should be.

Maybe you just need to make a human connection and that's what's going to be the expectation, lower your expectations without lowering your standards and it might actually make the conversation more fluid and you're not going to walk away disappointed and that will just help with your mental health to then feel good about the interview, feel good about the conversation once that conversations over, go back to your list, go back to your LinkedIn connections and start reaching out to new people to make new conversation, so instead of saying "I'm going to go set up interviews", maybe lower the expectations and say, "I'm going to set up conversations" and just have conversations and see where they go, we're always going to be prepared for a big interview if it comes right or if that's the nature of where that conversation goes but I said maybe you need to start preparing for the smaller, lower level expectations have conversations as well, so this way more meaningful things.

Jeff Altman 08:30
You know, when I talk to people about interviewing because that's my specialty, prepping people for interviews, I talked with him about competence is only one variable someone looks for and there you can execute this on your resume, be prepared to talk about honestly but they also look for self-confidence, character chemistry, maybe a little bit of charisma because in many roles, charismatic people are going to get hired over the nonferrous max but the final thing that someone looks for when they hire is they want to feel like they trust the person and that's really about the connection. It's about the relationship you can formulate with that other person where they can look across at you and go, "yeah, I don't have to worry about her".

Lisa Rangel 09:12
Right, and feel the comfort, I often use an analogy of even though the person on the interview is the guest, they get the candid, I say, try to treat the interview as if you were inviting someone into your living room like you would try to make their life comfortable, you would try to make their life easier, if you want to make sure they had what they needed, I said, if you go into an interview even as the guests with that mindset is that you're going to make someone feel better and I feel like most hires happen because the hiring manager feels like that person's going to make their life easier. I mean, nobody's getting hired because they're going to make their life harder however that needs to be conveyed whether it's fixing a challenge they're having or helping them capitalize on an opportunity they have before them whatever the situation is specifically, the end goal should be, how do I convey to this person, that I'm going to make their life easier and part of that is, I think softening the expectations around the conversation, so you can listen more, come across more at ease, come across more like a business partner evaluating the situation not a candidate being evaluating by a hired manager which has this survey and kind of vibes to it. I said, so, just maybe take it back, take it down a notch in terms of the expectation and that in itself is a mindset shift too because now you're going into this as a meeting of two equals versus the hiring manager and the candidate being evaluated, so much of this is the success comes from reframing things, lowering expectations in some ways easing up on things in other ways and just approaching people like humans. We've all been through a lot, some more than others but relatively speaking, it's all a lot for each of us and if we can come to the table with even more compassion than before, it's tends to pay off, nothing's absolute, nothing's 100% but you know...

Jeff Altman 11:35
It does...

Lisa Rangel 11:37
That's my take on it.

Jeff Altman 11:40
And I also think of that since we're talking about shifting mindsets and you raise the scenario earlier, I don't want to let go away. The depressed individual who's just gotten slammed in some way and they thought they did well then they get the feedback that basically says, "You stack up the joint". That's the way they hear it.

Lisa Rangel 12:02
That's the way they hear it, right.

Jeff Altman 12:04
Yeah. You helped someone, I know you explained, how you did, in this particular case if you were giving someone else a formula for, "I'm really in the dumps, and I’m awful. Oh, woe is me. I'll never get a job".

Lisa Rangel 12:27
When someone, you said, hears that they stink up the joint, I love that, your analogy. I'll just try to break it down with them and say, did they actually tell you that or you filling in that blank? so, I really tried to tell someone in absence of information, "Don't fill in the blanks" and if you're going to fill in the blanks intuitively or instinctively, certainly don't fill it in with false negative information until someone tells you, "Get the hell out of here, we don't want you", It's not a no, it may be a frustrating not yet unanswered scenario but that doesn't mean no and it certainly doesn't mean no because you're terrible, so in absence of information, "Don't fill in the blanks" and I think that we have to treat ourselves the way we would treat others, we often all of us have an advisory component to us in some capacity. Most of us do whether we're officially a coach or not, we have friends and family that come to us for advice and how would we talk to them, so I'll remind the person having that doom and gloom moment or period, say like, what you're telling yourself, would you tell your best friend who came to you with the same scenario?

Jeff Altman 13:57
No, I wouldn't do that.

Lisa Rangel 13:59
For your adult child or your coworker, of course not, so just easier said than done, I know that and I say that as someone who some days doesn't want to get up out of bed and who some days feels the weight of the world and I can't fix it, so I empathize as much as I can but we just got to zero in on, what is exactly the task in front of us and if the task in front of us is to send an email to a hiring manager then that's the task in front of us today, if that's the only thing somebody who is really down in the dumps gets done that day that's a victory,


JeffAltman, The Big Game Hunter
JeffAltman, The Big Game Hunter

Jeff Altman, The Big Game Hunter is a coach who worked as a recruiter for what seems like one hundred years. His work involves career coaching, all as well as executive job search coaching, job coaching, and interview coaching. He is the host of “No BS Job Search Advice Radio,” the #1 podcast in iTunes for job search with more than 2100 episodes, and is a member of The Forbes Coaches Council.

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