Olivia Jaras and I speak about job hunting during these crazy times in a free-flowing conversation. Amusingly, we both do an introduction at the beginning of the video.

Post-Pandemic Job Hunting | JobSearchTV.com

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This is an automated transcript without editing. I'm sure it has a few errors.

Hi! I'm Jeff Altman, The Big Game Hunter and welcome back to JobSearchTV.com
This is going to be fun. I've interviewed Olivia Jaras before
she's interviewed me before and we got together to talk about
INTERVIEWING DURING PANDEMIC! Ooh! Ooh! Drama!
drama so we're both going to share this information
uh with different audiences and she's going to introduce herself now and
maybe me. So, Olivia, take it away!
I am not hearing.
Can you hear me now?
I hear you and you can be there
listen this i have a new microphone and this thing is driving me a little bit
crazy but ladies who are listening to this
this is an impromptu session that jeff and i
and you know who jeff is he is the big game hunter he
is the top dog when it comes down to interviewing and acing difficult
interviews and we are here today because both of us
were like you know what things are going a little crazy in this
world and things are changing and so should
your strategy especially when it comes down to landing your dream opportunity
connecting with that dream opportunity interviewing for that new position so
many people are losing their jobs and are finding themselves trying to
connect with new opportunities but they don't necessarily
know how things have changed with covid19 hence we're here
so for the next couple of minutes you better be paying attention because this
is going to be a total game changer for opening doors and opportunities
that you perhaps didn't think you have how did i do
you're doing great and we're going to do this no bs style
i'm not going to wind up filtering anything this is completely off the cuff
we're going to have fun yeah i'm excited all right
okay where should we start olivia i want to start this off if that's okay
with you i cannot tell you how many emails like
we run this thing called the herlington challenge
how many ladies keep talking about like oh my gosh i connected with
someone at xyz company how do i have a conversation like
how do i even start interviewing with people or how do i approach this
fact that even if i did have an opportunity
i can't move i'm here like what do they do
what what's changed in these times so i want to start off with that at a girl
for that person and if you're a guy doing this and
attaboy because you did the right thing you started off
with networking which is really going to be the ticket
for getting back to work as we're recording this since
beginning of march when the country was shut down 36 million people have lost
their jobs a certain number of them are going
to be coming back to work it's going to be slow it's like a drip
marketing it's going to be a slow process and i've started to talk to
employers about their hiring process because i believe a lot of employers are
going to find hiring by video a scary thing
for them because they've got to learn a different skill set
and they've got to take the leap of faith
part of your video yeah part of your job folks is to make yourself
into someone that they can trust now where does all of this start i believe
it starts with your network of relationships
and reconnecting with folks and doing it in the most graceful way
you possibly can now this is a little bit before your
question so again i'm going to come back to the
question specifically but that's right right networking is important big time
and this is like the christmas period in terms of
how easy it is to network because like a christmas
it feels like a hundred years since we were last in contact is the typical text
or email i tell people to send to folks well this is the
time is it where you can say to people hey
i know it's been a long time but your name popped into my mind
i just want to see how you were and how your family was
are you okay what's been going on for you
it's about the reconnection about reconnecting with people from your
past now as always not everyone's going to
respond it's just the way it is but the right
people will now sometimes your email may be caught
by spam filters and no disrespect you know to uh
the different mail services but sometimes they overreach
like happened with someone i'm coaching now who
messaged an old client of his his message got caught
in the corporate servers uh and was treated as spam
so just be aware you may need to follow up
at least once so well and that that's one of the the
interesting things is that people don't necessarily
realize that right now during this crisis
is a perfect opportunity to reach out to long-lost connections that could
actually help hook you up with that next opportunity
like there's such an opportunity hidden that
most people overlook and they're not seeing how
indeed there's there's gold right here like this is the
time to reach out to that old connection that former client
that former boss and ask to see how they're doing like that's
genius and thank you and
again this is like an informational interview
a process where you're checking in with people
how are you what's been going on for you how's your wife husband partner how the
kids you know what's going on for you and you
sit and listen and you share stories you
just make it a personal contact now conversation too
may take place a week or two later and this is where we're coming back to the
original question where you can speak with someone go you
know i was wondering what's going on in your
organization now this person was networking this
person was already networking and this is a slightly different
language that you might use where you're in the position where you
say hey look i'm one of the 36 million and yours is an organization i've
targeted i'd really love to be associated and
this is what i do you don't know me from a
hole in the wall but i'm looking for information about
how i might approach your organization whether i keep your name out of it or
not that's your decision my feelings aren't hurt if you say no
but i like that but i really like that thank you what's going on there
and if you want to take a half step back you can also say
i'm curious about what you are seeing in your industry
as as the economy is opening up what's the conversation in your
organization about bringing people back and bringing
people on and thus here's their listening and
you're asking appropriate follow-up questions like
what sort of people are they bringing back what sort of people are they
considering bringing on board what are you hearing
how is this affecting budget cycle now i'm mentioning budget cycle for a reason
because as we're recording this it's mid-may
2020. if you think about when calendar year corporations finalize
budgets you know this october right
september they're there it depends it depends on the
company that's a tricky question i know that but
at latest it's october now the goal you should have with your
network is that you're in front of people that
you know and thus maybe they can write you into
the budget right and those things although a lot of
people right now are kind of holding off on adding
anything to the budget because they see the uncertain
future like this truly resembles depression whether we call it or not a
recession period right where people are like
stalling just because of the fear of the unknown
but you can take advantage of it too right one of the things i think kind
of can also tie into what you're saying is when
you see that there is no budget right or allegedly they're telling you that
there's no budget or that you can foresee them saying that there's
going to be no budget what you can do is offer to help them out
for free for a couple of weeks and i know this is unconventional but
we've gotten women hired many places by using this technique by kind of
offering up to lighten the load of the ceo for a little
while in fact i got i i've hired teammates in our team
like that too and it works especially when they're under stress
when they realize that they can trust you and
help the situation like that is one way to deal with budget but sorry
i totally cut you off there no no because everything works it never it
just never works as as often as we would like it to work and
thus the idea is to put out ideas to people of how you can serve
so in your example of working free or another version of that is
i don't know if you might need someone on an interim basis
as you know with a particular expertise like mine
where you know you're working you know as an individual who appeared as a
consultant attempt whatever the level of employment you
have in a staff augmentation basis that
allows them to evaluate your work or do it free either way is fine
whatever works for them because it gets you in the door the goal
is some version of extended relationship
with someone and a lot of people don't push back and
say no no no no let's just keep talking and get
acquainted and there's a difference between what
you can broach with someone that you know
versus someone that you don't know right someone should do that well someone that
you know you may injure may introduce you to someone but your
job is to get in front of the process because there are still folks that are
sitting around at home watching netflix and they're not being
proactive this is not going to be a recovery
that's going to be based upon answering job ads that
that's casting your line in the water where there's lots of fish and you're
expecting to be the one fish that jumps on the hook
doesn't work
the statistical probability is pretty small
the idea is under the under the best of circumstances
70 percent of positions are filled as a result of your network
seventy percent of the seventy percent come as a result of introductions to
people your network knows who you don't so you've gotta start working your
connections and recruiters agency recruiters
are not going to be tremendously helpful now i tell you
you should contact them i worked in search for more than 40 years i've got
nothing against the careers and their importance is
going to be minimized because they're staring at hr organizations who
are going to pay a fee for 36 million people to choose from let's
see who's out there for free first before we start writing out expensive
checks right you know this from your own experience
right so they don't contact the recruiter
or do they still contact the recruiter just in case you do
everything yeah i think i think you should
throw the kitchen thing sink strategy like do the kitchen sink
and throw it at everything right connect with your network
try to get introductions through your network to
broaden your network but then also if there are recruiters and headhunters
hiring well then connect with them too but one of the things
though that i will warn and that is from my experience
in in like the compensation side of the world that
organizations broadly speaking when times
are not looking good ahead some of the first people to go
are recruiters and headhunters and hiring managers because
you're downsizing like if you're facing a downsize those are the
front line i i mean i'm sorry for any recruiter headhunter who's
hearing me here but you guys probably know this right
those are the first people to go so they already know
you know sorry i was talking to a former client of mine from when i did search
yesterday and yeah he most recently ran
corporate hr for multi-billion dollar firm
terrific guy i enjoyed working with him as a client he was at the door
three months ago he said i came close on cove
but covey got in the way on three uh jobs i was up for and now he's basically
sucking wind he's got nothing going on uh at the
point where he might be selling his house moving uh back to
his original place of residence all that sort of
stuff because it's within the school year
so that might be the best approach for but for those of you who are looking you
have to spend most of your time on your network
not on looking on job boards not looking at publicly that is shared
you need to be looking at your own network
not at the job boards it's all about time management now
you know if you think that 70 of jobs are going to be filled through
your network why are you spending 70 of your time or more on job boards
makes no sense but that's what people do because networking feels hard
but if you treat it as something where it's reconnecting with people from your
past and asking them who they know right and
taking advantage of this opportunity right now like this is where i was
thinking i'm like man networking right now is so easy
i've actually reached out to people that i like actually this this happened to me
there's this one person that i truly admire and i wanted to interview
him i've wanted to interview him for my podcast for years
his name is joe navarro and i in the past i've written to him
four times and i've totally been rejected right but some of the times
like i wasn't actually asking for him to be on my podcast but i was just
checking in saying hey hope you're doing real
blah blah but this time i probably three weeks ago
i sent him an email and said hey i hope you and your family are doing well
throughout this crisis i was just thinking of all of you and
i was wondering if perhaps maybe you have a couple of minutes to hop
on an interview with me and pretty pretty pretty please fulfill
this dream that i've had of interviewing you
for years guess what not only did i get him on the interview
but i also got him to refer another expert that i've also been wanting to
interview to get on board too so it's
time if you've never networked if you've always sucked at networking like
right now is the perfect time to do this and i'm going to change
your language just a little bit it's not that you suck at networking
most of the time people are afraid to network they don't want to look like one
of those people uh they don't want to seem desperate
they're afraid of rejection let's just accept the notion that a lot
of folks are going to be rejected but you still got to do it anymore
right and the truth is like i think though
there's always approach right a no right now a rejection right now
doesn't mean a rejection forever i mean joe rejected me
three different times you kept saying like oh sorry just my books in the
pipeline i can't do this i can't do this and finally said yes right so
i mean a rejection right now like and this is something that i think
in particularly particular seems to hurt women is that we feel
a rejection is a no on us like a failure on us that we don't
deserve it that we're bad that we're not good enough
right when really all it means is in this case for example it was no
because it i don't have time right now that i don't want to help you it's just
right now is the bad time and it could be the bad time
right now when you connect with someone right what do you do
if you get rejected like what do you suggest
when i worked in search and we lost a placement someone turned down an
offer or they accepted a counter offer and we lost a fee
the common language in the office was to say
next you got to go on to the next thing yes it's okay to lick your wounds a
little bit and feel the disappointment but to let it languish for lengthy
periods of time doesn't serve you it's like
i'm going to use an example i believe interviewing in job search is very much
like dating and thus the notion of being broken up
with is very simple yes that's true
it has a similar feel to it i've been rejected
and it's okay to feel rejected but you can't
allow yourself to wallow in it it's you have to lick your wounds and go on
to the next thing it doesn't have to be the next 10 seconds that you do
although if you're able to pull that off great but i don't think it's really
useful i think it's okay to to languish in it for no more than 24
hours and then move on and start getting to the next thing
and reaching out some more so right rejection is going to happen
but you have to not dwell on it and i love that idea and
especially because we get to so tied up emotionally like you're saying it's kind
of like a breakup but the reality is
it's not on you necessarily it might be something
completely unrelated as he pointed out he had a book to do right and it wasn't
the right time for him or they may have a project that they're
doing or they have travel that's already booked and it's just not
a convenient time whatever it is it's not about
you it's about them now you know that i would probably
suggest your starting point to be your email
network like you've got so many email addresses
to start looking through and sifting through to start networking but i'd
also suggest linkedin is there anything that you would suggest they do other
than those two yeah you missed one
text network text network you're so 1990s talking about the email
for the people that you're really close to you text them
so start with your text network and then
or facebook because those are people that you may know personally
and it's less formal than linkedin right i love that start
start with text go to email then go to facebook or do those two at
the same time and then go to linkedin you can send
messages to people through messenger so it's a private message
you don't have to publicly say i'm pathetic i need a job can anyone help me
and you know no one's gonna respond to that
right and if they do they're gonna give you the pat on the head
but right what you're now able to do with facebook which is really
a fun idea is they now have their equivalent of zoom and skype with
facebook rooms so you so if this is not designed to be
sexual as i say it you can grab a room with someone
and start the conversation pretty quickly
that's awesome all right well ladies and gentlemen
here you have it this is our primer on how do you
deal with interviews in during this covet 19 craziness how do you
actually take advantage of the situation to reconnect with your
network and start landing those dream opportunities
and i'm going to remind you ladies and gentlemen winners find the way to
win and your excuses aren't going to get you
across the finish line you just have to keep doing the stuff
that is going to work it may not work as often as you like it
never works as often as we like but you just got to keep putting one
foot in front of the oven
wasn't that a fun conversation i'm jeff altman
olivia and i have known one another for about a year now and
it was a fun impromptu conversation about how to job hunt during pandemic
let me just say if you're interested in my coaching you
visit my website the big game hundred dot us there's a
button there that says schedule schedule time for free discovery call or
scheduled time for coaching i'd love to help you in addition
subscribe to my channel on youtube you do that by clicking the small icon the
lower right or the picture of me in the upper left
and i'm sure you know some people who could
be helped by this video forward it to them share it share it on
social media do stuff to get the word out about how
to job hunt during these times i'll be back soon with more in the
meantime i hope you have a great day be great

ABOUT JEFF ALTMAN, THE BIG GAME HUNTER

Jeff Altman, The Big Game Hunter
Jeff Altman, The Big Game Hunter

Jeff Altman, The Big Game Hunter is a coach who worked as a receems like one hundred years. His work involves career coaching, all as well as executive job search coaching, job coaching and interview coaching. He is the host of “No BS Job Search Advice Radio,” the #1 podcast in iTunes for job search with more than 2200 episodes and “The No BS Coaching Advice Podcast” and is a member of The Forbes Coaches Council. “No BS JobSearch Advice Radio” was named a Top 10 podcast for job search. JobSearchTV.com is also a Top 10 YouTube channel for job search.

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